SUMMARY MINUTES OF JOINT DINNER MEETING

Monday, May 9, 2005

Shoreline Conference Center

6:00 p.m. Highlander Room

City Council:

PRESENT: Deputy Mayor Jepsen, Councilmembers Chang, Fimia, Grace, Gustafson and Ransom

ABSENT: Mayor Hansen

Planning Commission:

PRESENT: Chair Harris, Commissioners Broili, Hall, Kuboi, MacClelland, Phisuthikul, MacCully, and Sands

ABSENT: Vice Chair Piro

STAFF: Steve Burkett, City Manager; Bob Olander, Deputy City Manager; Julie Modrzejewski, Assistant City Manager; Joyce Nichols, Communications and Intergovernmental Relations Director; Tim Stewart, Planning and Development Services Director; and Andrea Spencer, Senior Planner

Deputy Mayor Jepsen called the meeting to order at 6:30 p.m.

Councilmembers thanked all the Planning Commissioners for their time and effort serving on the Planning Commission.

Councilmember Grace said the Planning Commission minutes are useful by helping him make an informed decision. Deputy Mayor Jepsen agreed and expressed his appreciation to those Commissioners who reach out to the Council by calling the Council. Councilmember Gustafson said that he draws upon Commissioners’ support and thoroughness.

Councilmember Ransom said that he reads the Planning Commission minutes in detail and expressed that as Planning Commissioners they are representing the neighborhoods and what are considered acceptable standards. He stated that the City Councilmembers are electeds and are concerned about the constituencies. He said it would be helpful if the Planning Commission would try to resolve the controversial issues before they come to the Council. In addition, he stated that if it is a hot issue, this is why the Council spends a lot of time on it.

Councilmember Fimia stated that the most controversial issues are land use issues, and the Council appoints the Planning Commission to represent the Council. She added that if there is still discomfort or frustration with a Planning Commission decision, it is because they have not found the right decision for the public. She said that there must be a balance between protecting the environment and allowing growth. She continued by saying that there is a strong environmental ethic in Shoreline. When making decisions, it would be helpful if the Planning Commission thinks about the Shoreline ethic and tradition, but also looks for innovation such as with cottage housing.

Councilmember Chang agreed with every Councilmember and expressed how difficult the Planning Commission’s job is.

Deputy Mayor Jepsen stated that they value economic stability and the environment and this is a challenge as a city. He continued by saying that he does not envy Commissioners because they are making decisions on the ground, having to permit quickly and protect the environment.

Commissioner Hall said that the Commissioners have asked staff to identify where the controversies are so that they can try to compromise. He asked the Council if there was a way for the Commission to frame the discussion if it continues to be an issue regardless of a compromise.

Councilmember Fimia suggested that the Council decide with the Planning Commission what should be the public process, such as with the Critical Areas Ordinance process. By the time the issue gets to Council, the Council won’t need to question the process because it would have been agreed upon up front. She continued by saying that if people have to fight to be heard they will become paranoid.

Commissioner McClelland said that she was concerned about the mean spiritedness of those doing the debating. She continued to say that she wished that people were as heated about children as they are about fish.

Commissioner Sands agreed with Councilmember Fimia’s suggestion, and said that the process should be agreed upon in advance. He continued by saying that lots of time was spent at open houses and with lots of time to speak. However, it appears that the same people are speaking over and over. He said that he is frustrated because lots of time has been spent on an issue before it goes to the Council, yet it is portrayed like this is the first time people have had a chance to talk about it. The 15-20 people who they see over and over appear as if they have a specific axe to grind. He does not want to see a small vocal minority direct what is going on in the City. He said that he feels they are never going to please them, and if they do they will do a disservice to the public at large. He continued by saying that there is a lot of experience on the Commission and everyone is highly qualified; they are non political and do their best to use the best available science.

Commission Chair Harris said that the Commission agendas are driven by the staff through applications and permits.

Councilmember Grace asked how they could get broader representative participation and said that this was a topic they discussed at their retreat.

Commissioner Kuboi asked the Council if there was anything else they could add to make the minutes more useful and if they felt they could rely on the minutes. The Planning Commissioners have discussed getting the right kind of discussion and debate.

Chair Harris said that they are making sure the minority opinion is recorded.

Commissioner McClelland said that many of them talk to the staff ahead of the meeting. In addition, she said that she would like to stop the notion that they are not getting good service from staff; she said that they are getting accurate information and are well informed. She continued that it is the wrong message to send to our community that we do not have a good staff. She wants to dispel the belief that staff cannot be trusted and that they are in charge or manipulating them.

Commissioner Kuboi asked the Council if they felt the whole City was fairly represented. He said that he has heard comments that they are not offering a representation. He did not agree with this assumption and stated that he believed the Commission did represent the City fairly.

Councilmember Ransom said that they generally don’t get candidates from the east side.

Deputy Mayor Jepsen moved the discussion to the Comprehensive Plan update by asking what worked and what didn’t work. Commissioner Broili said that he was not a Commissioner when the process started but as a participant he felt that at individual meetings there were no opportunities for the public to provide input and that people felt left out. He continued by saying that he appreciated the Sno-King Environmental Council meeting and said that there was time to go into depth on some of the issues (more than three minutes), and this was valuable.

Commissioner Sands explained that the Comprehensive Plan update was divided into groupings. It was decided that there would be no input at workshops. It took 1 ½ years to review it as it was. There were 80-90 pages, single space, of individual comments from the community to references in the plan. He believed that everyone got their two cents and that every item was reviewed.

Commissioner McClelland shared that the Planning Commission held three community meetings.

Commissioner Hall said that they could have done better weighing everything that came to them. They reached a decision by whose values they chose to accept as the majority. He added that they listened equally but they made judgments.

Commissioner MacCully said that he wanted to make sure the Council doesn’t cover ground over and over again with the same people. He added that the Council is not hearing from people whose recommendation they did include.

Commissioner McClelland believed the question was: did they not get heard or did they not get their way? She added that they were under a lot of pressure to complete the update and to move it forward within 16 months.

Deputy Mayor Jepsen asked whether, based on how people reacted to the Comprehensive Plan, the Critical Areas Ordinance should be handled differently.

Commissioner MacCully said that they are not political. He said that the Commission has the luxury of not looking at issues in this way. The Council has to take politics into consideration.

Councilmember Fimia said that everyone does politics whether or not they know it. She added that it is human to take things with political filters. She continued by saying that a good decision has to have both a political and analytical component; it cannot contain just the political or the analysis piece. She said that the Commission makes the first cut and listens to the public. She said that these 15-20 people have been here before Shoreline was a city; they gave birth to this place and now they feel this isn’t their community anymore. It is a mistake to discount them as a group.

Deputy Mayor Jepsen said that they need to keep in mind that there is a variety of personalities on the Council.

Councilmember Ransom suggested that the Planning Commission provide in the minutes the reasons why a stakeholder’s recommendation did not become part of the Planning Commission recommendation.

Deputy Mayor Jepsen adjourned the meeting at: 7:25 p.m.

Julie Modrzejewski, Assistant City Manager